Possible Abuse in mechanics of SO Main

[DarkChaos]

This is from Snowy the street Person who sells themself for money (#117652)


I believe joe ro is guilty of abusing game mechanics in the state that asking his / her friends to attack them when he / she is prepared with "pships" out to recieve a duration of "Neb" which is beneficial to his / her own interests.

This was a repetitve action day in and day out performed by joe ro and this method of abusing game mechanics in his favour have made him untouchable on what should be a highly PvP orientated server.

Letting joe ro claim a top spot this round will only show other players that abusing game mechanics will result in rewards.

I do not believe this to be a legit reasoning for him to qualify this round, and i push for a disqualification of ranking of the player Joe Ro
 

[The-Joe]

After you conquering two of my planets, and having the last nebula as a result of your own attack as it is seen in the logs:
Attack ON you     Remote Attack - Scout
Full Report    Snowy the street Person who sells themself for money(#117652)    305.154.960.008.712    801.167.650.834.802    2009-08-10 06:01:3

I find-it very strange for you to whine.
Nebula is a very old part of the game, used for protection against attackers. It's true i used every part of the game i know, but this is playing the game not exploiting-it.
If you and your alliance would have wanted, you would have triggered DDay. There is no nebula protection in DDAy.
My strategy was always to keep my resources for dday... as it is the single most important war in the game, and to always use them in a decisive manner, not to waste them in small quarrels with bullyes.

I choose to keep the protection and not use my counters as a strategic choice.

You attacked me as you were 1000 times stronger than me... and took the planet containing every worker i had, and i had no way to counter. You had 1,5 trill lead ship and lieutenant grade while i was having 20 bill ship and was corporal. You had the most powerful allies in the game possible. So at a time of the game you held all the cards, but played them badly. I maxed before you, now you feel frustrated that i maxed and i won the battle. That's called outplaying you not cheating.
The object of the game for me is to win. The strategy is based on the conditions met in field.

About exploits... SirEmi can check all the data and will find i just worked very very hard to win.
"You have 71  turn(s) left. 244615 turn(s) used."

My counter on you taking my planet at the start of the game was to max out before you. I just did-it.

[DarkChaos]

Snowy the street Person who sells themself for money (#117652)



That's the most pathetic grobbling excuse I have heard joe ro, you try to stand rectified that your so glorious because you abused a game mechanic so often that it made you untouchable, I don't see any justice in someone such as yourself obtaining a position in the top 10 without having done anything this round but stay immune from attacks.

[The-Joe]

Snowy the street Person who sells themself for money(#117652)     Joe-RO 650 trill     1     -1     0    2009-08-06 10:57:14

I rest my case

[blakranger51]

I don't think buddy nebbing is a punishable offense, although I could be wrong. We have had this problem before; while it is annoying in the end it often doesn't make a difference because eventually they'll miss an hour or two and someone will take advantage of it. It's a dishonorable tactic, but I believe a legal one. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, its been awhile since this problem surfaced.

[Cameron07]

buddy nebbing should be a punishable offense... i keep saying this over and over and it would take care of most of the neb problems but emi never listens... put restrictions on full assualt attacks... cant hit over 500% of your fp... takes out most alt nebbing right there... and make alliance members not able to attack each other.. alliance must truce itself... then if you want to buddy neb you have to find someone outside of your alliance.. making it much harder right there

[Renshaak]

Buddy nebbing is annoying--but nowhere near so much as spending your way to an untouchable situation and attacking anything and everything in one's path.  This eventually brought out the worst in everyone else and this is how it was manifested.  Sometimes you reap what you sow.

Congratulations, Joe.  You beat the bully at his own game--just in a different way.

[The-Joe]

There are many things that Emi can change. Removing nebula would mean that only one alliance will rule the game, and the top one player at one time will decide who else get's the luck to be in the top.

And about buddy nebbing, my last nebula:

Attack ON you     Remote Attack - Scout
Full Report    Snowy the street Person who sells themself for money(#117652)    305.154.960.008.712    801.167.650.834.802    2009-08-10 06:01:39
Nebula times         Snowy the street Person who sells themself for money(#117652)     7.43 h     24.00 h     7.43 h    2009-08-10 06:01:40

If Snowy is my buddy... OMG than we are talking about what? Maby I am Snowy and i nebbed myslef...

True i used nebula to grow, but i also have Time field generator 60 %, meaning that i could afford to wait to get nebbed by higher power commanders at that time (such as Fender-Bender) that dropped ranks and used tiny to kill the lower power commanders (such i was).

Since mister Snowy does not know how much it costs to either reserve or sell the ships everytime you log out, because you are vulnerable to very high ranking players, and grind like hell to get the means to do anything, he has the wrong impression that is easy.

Avoiding all incursions because they are the hunting grounds for low players... and drool about the nice rewards they give.... is frustrating.

Meanwhile he stood comfortable on top of  huge planets i could not afford to attack, protected by space stations i could not see, probably with fighters bays filled with fighters worth 1000 times the value of all i had.

Yesterday i could have 0'ed him because he scouted me and i had a counter... and guess who had no ships out?

BTW... he is nebbed right now... and it wasn't my doing.

I don't really understand why he is so upset, because after taking my planet, he told me he wishes to see me max before others...

[Renshaak]

I've been pulpiting like crazy (not surprising as I am a little nuts) it seems lately on the topic of PvP.  Even the grinders/simmers aren't saying to get rid of PvP.  The brand that many PvPers seem to want though is a brand where it's jr. high kids bullying third graders.  It's not a competetive combat where you really need to calculate who you hit and what they might do.  It's more get 7 orders of magnitude more powerful then take out every single non-allied resource you can find. 

This mindset continues to kill the game.  In my alt's alliance another pretty eager player said goodbye this morning because he's sick of being nothing but fodder.  It's like signing up to play a WWII game then finding out that one player has dictated you get to play the role of Ukrainian peasant.  May be cool to that one player, but everyone else gets tired and either finds their own way around the problem or (more commonly) quits before there's a large enough base of skilled players to have decent PvP.

[Saturn 7]

Sorry I must say to Fender/snowy that you are not in a position to complain. You donated an obscene amount of real life money in able to bully everyone but a select few of people that pallyed up to you early on. You made this round totally unbalanced and impossible to play without resorting to unethical tactics (but not against the rules) You have made it impossible for most of the server to build a planet and you have attacked lower level people for no real reason. I have heard you wanted to attack everyone that has been in the top 10 previous rounds, but that isnt the case, you have attacked people that have never reached that level.
I have never before this round resorted to buddy nebbing, but I must admit a couple of times I have had to, to stay in the round. I dont do it all the time , I have researched and increased my max turns so that I can wait longer for neb cover to bring my ships out. Hopefully this will be the only round that I will ever have to.
Buddy nebbing is something most alliances do, especially your old alliance Loki. I have also seen quite a few people in the top 10 buddy neb but I'm not gonna mention any names. Your the only reason I even considered Buddy nebbing, if you had played fairly and from an equal starting position then I would not do so, giving you the chance to visit my mains.
Sorry for my rant, hopefully its my first and last.
Lets hope for a better understanding between us for next round.

[TNTTony]

So much stuff has been said since I went to sleep lol, so I can't talk about it all. So I will try and clarify some important points:

Fender~Bender aka Snowy the street Person who sells themself for money

Snowy is one of those players that everyone would want in their alliance. Seriously. Admittedly at the beginning of the round I wasn't sure how to view snowy but I now see that he is an important member in any alliance. When spayed and I were attacking the weaker loki members (mj, tim, kasane etc etc) snowy would power down every day to try and attack us. He would put fleets up to protect his members stations and planets. Since snowy and us joined forces he has done the same. Constantly reserving and selling in order to power down and help his team mates. On top of this the countless hours he design ships to give to team mates.

So...

Since mister Snowy does not know how much it costs to either reserve or sell the ships everytime you log out, because you are vulnerable to very high ranking players, and grind like hell to get the means to do anything, he has the wrong impression that is easy.

Joe this is wrong. Snowy knows more about the cost of reserving and selling more than anyone in the game. Personally I know that the tactic you use is hard and tedious but the point snowy is trying to make (and maybe he was a bit too pasionate about his words  ) is that the CONSTANT buddy neb makes you untouchable. As this is a competition server and pvp game, players should be allowed to stop someone from maxing or dent their economy. What you did meant that you were untouchable. So no competition.

Lets be honest. Everyone at some point has buddy nebbed. But to do it alot is different.

If you and your alliance would have wanted, you would have triggered DDay. There is no nebula protection in DDAy.
My strategy was always to keep my resources for dday... as it is the single most important war in the game, and to always use them in a decisive manner, not to waste them in small quarrels with bullyes.

No we can't trigger dday. We need 20 people and we only have 9 active players.
Your stragety was to max...not for dday. Lets be honest as well about the dday. Dday is not about war but about having as much creds as possible 10 seconds before dday ends.

So at a time of the game you held all the cards, but played them badly. I maxed before you, now you feel frustrated that i maxed and i won the battle. That's called outplaying you not cheating.
The object of the game for me is to win. The strategy is based on the conditions met in field.

Yes you did out play him and yes the object of the game is to win. But let it be known that the reason why snowy didn't make before you is because he was spending his money helping his alliance. While you nebbed yourself and grinded, he helped his alliance mates. While you nebbed yourself, he was powering down to ensure his team mates was safe.

Its a bit like a running race. Snowy is first, you are second. Snowy has a commanding lead over you BUT then he stops to help a fallen mate...and you take first place.


My last comment is this. This game certainly need changes no doubt about that and some of the ideas by ren, joe and others are really good. Let work on the positive.

[Spayed]

well f**k me, you all rite to f**k**g much f**k**g lean how to make dot points and sumarise....

ban buddy nebbing..

not much we can do about it now.

but alliances dont run the game, alliances that work together run it. snowy could have blazed ahead and maxed ages ago.. instead he stays down helping the alliance, attacking contenders.. well those who dont hide like little bitches anyway...

if buddy nebbing is still active next round our alliance will be declaring war on the entire server, any planet, any station and ship we see out will be ours.... if u dont like it, dont buddy neb and play the game like its supposed to b played...

[The-Joe]

I have proven that i was by no means invulnerable. I lost two planets, i lost the active lead as well. I have lost the 650 trill main, that was the lead i used at that time.

Even with buddy-nebbing banned there are ways i know and will use to stay as untouchable as i can. There is no other choice for me since most of the powerful players are gathered in one alliance. I have perfected the techniques while being in LOI and WOS alliances in the low ranks as Kryo Midnight cammy and Nighty were fighting Wolfy, and i had to take the heat from all wolfy's alliance buddyes, and their allies. I had to perfect those while i was in AE and LOESC and the elites attacked me and 0'ed me constantly.

Each round i played i was hit hard but never 0'ed and learned to outlive most people. I don't care about buddy nebbing banned since i don't need buddyes to get nebbed. I just need nebula to exist.

Now you all speak from the position of dominance. What if the roles were reversed, and some really nerved players would gather and you would be the underdogs? What would you do having no nebula to protect you, and having planets and space stations wiped in less than 24 hours each day?
What upsets you is that i have chosen not to waste turns and resources to fight a already lost battle against you and defy you by chasing the goal to win. And i was closer to be first than you could ever imagine. I was 75 quads short of maxing and out of turns some hours before tony maxed.
Yes, you lost turns and credits to attack all other challengers and i did not... your goal was to break me, my goal was to win the game despite you. What's wrong with that?

However, if changes are not made, if i would have been in your position i would have known ways to hurt you all even in nebula. But that will remain my trade secret for the rounds i will choose to play that way.
You have invested in planets, i have lost my planet and chosen not to do-it anymore because there was no way i could have defended them. That left me turns, credits and cp's to use in a different manner.
And you are not such great warriors as you say, because this round since you could not beat fender you joined him... Bully people into your alliance if you feel threatened... join and 0 anyone that does not comply, that's a really positive attitude, and fair fight technique.

However i was accused of exploiting... and i have proven with logs there was no exploiting required.
My hat off for MJ who survived to the tops and even battled you.

The whole point here is that i managed to get into the top, with 0 donations except the gold account, but using skill and hard work. Ban me for daring.. i have proven my point for all other players.

[The-Joe]

well f**k me, you all rite to f**k**g much f**k**g lean how to make dot points and sumarise....
if buddy nebbing is still active next round our alliance will be declaring war on the entire server, any planet, any station and ship we see out will be ours.... if u dont like it, dont buddy neb and play the game like its supposed to b played...

That was exactly what happened this round... so that's empty threat.

I have lost at least 5-6 space stations and mining facilities this round (forgot to mention on the "invulnerability" issue). And i have decided it's pointless to do any more of them. And i don't know any player outside your alliance that had none lost. I had to max my stats using alien grinding... i still dream the alien icon at night.

[Spayed]

lol we didnty make fender join us, he wanted to, and up untill the point he joined i was fighting him, far more sucessfully then anybody else was..

mj does buddy neb as do the entire of loki..
hving spys in there alliance all round gives us proof that they did it..
i could also say the same about more of nem joe...

you did well, you decieved us and managed to max much quicker then i thought you would, but that were made possible by other people being higher then you and you being able to pick off larger encounters..

its not so easy when you lead the round start to finnish.. you have to deal with no encounters and no way to make money later on... if you can lead a round from start to finish then ill respect you, compete with us in pvp and ill really respect you