Pships - basics at least?

[Ziegfried]

hello gentlemen. nice to meet everyone. first post here.

so i've been told that to safeguard my pathetic little guard ship (worth several days of my income) i can reserve it or use a pship (or both?). pship sounds like a good idea. i've read somewhere about people getting really nice ratios like 1/.72 credit/fleet power ratio for these, but after experimenting, the best i got was 8 something credits per 1 fleet power. since a pship is a large garbage can, it would be nice to know if there's a way to do that.

so any help? like the number of weapons you need to use (1-10-100?) or such? i don't know how fleet power is calculated, so sadly, i'm at a loss.

thanks ahead of time.

[Spayed]

well there are  afew  different types of p shippys i think ill go with the most basic one, the one without hitpoints

they also work best with alot of smaller weapons on them with a very small acu 1% actaully because they are just meant to die there is no point putting anymore then that in them .

the weapon i use is just 1 weight, 1% acu, 174 energy and 17123 attack

and use lots of these depending on how big you want the ship.

from the amount of weapons and the size of the ship you want you should be able to figure out what size and energy your powercore needs to be.

[Chronos]

Generally, the more weapons the better, I think.

Of course, it was a lot more annoying to add multiple weapons back in my day. I've never used a power ship with more than 25 weapons. I might be wrong on this.

You use only 1% accuracy because the power a weapon generates only depends upon attack, not accuracy. (Or something like that.) Basically, anything you put in accuracy is wasted as far as power goes.

Oh, and I would strongly advise against using less than 8 weight in a weapon. In fact, there is no real reason to go with any amount other than 8 weight in a weapon, unless your ship has less than, what, 20 space? Something like that? Anyways, I justify the number 8 here.

[plug]

Generally, the more weapons the better, I think.

Of course, it was a lot more annoying to add multiple weapons back in my day. I've never used a power ship with more than 25 weapons. I might be wrong on this.

You use only 1% accuracy because the power a weapon generates only depends upon attack, not accuracy. (Or something like that.) Basically, anything you put in accuracy is wasted as far as power goes.

Oh, and I would strongly advise against using less than 8 weight in a weapon. In fact, there is no real reason to go with any amount other than 8 weight in a weapon, unless your ship has less than, what, 20 space? Something like that? Anyways, I justify the number 8here.

If you put a 8 weight weapon on the pship, that would mean additional cost of 1155 (7*165) cr per ship.

If you make 1 million of these, that would mean an additional 1.155 billion cr. The same billion I could use to make another mission ship.

Edit:

Here's what I got after I plug in some numbers:

For 1 weight weapon, 17123 att at 1%, yielding effective hit rate of 171.

For 8 weight weapon, 37443 att at 1%, yielding effective hit rate of 374.

That means, a cost of increase 1155 cr per ship, the effective hit rate goes up 203 point.

203/171 = 1.187 or a 19% increase.

In other words, if the pship worth more than 6078 cr each, using an 8 weight weapon makes sense.

If the pship worth less than 6078 cr each, it is advisable to lessen the weapon weight.

And the impact isn't that immense, really.

For example: A decrease of size from 8 weight to 7 weight requires 1000 LESS en cost, which translate to output of 333 LESS att power, and at 1% accuracy, the effective att yield is only 3.

Yes, you read it right, only 3 less att yield per ship !

Referring to the above figure of 374 effective att yield per ship, 3 is less than 1%. But the saving is huge in comparison ---> 165 cr per ship !

Even in a one-million pship configuration, the total effect of 3 less att yield is still less than 6 million att yield.

[Chronos]

There are a number of things wrong with your argument.

First off, power is derived from raw attack, not effective attack. You do not multiply anything by 1%.

Second, the correct percentage increase for your example would be (37443/17123 - 1) ≈ (374/171 - 1) = 1.187 = 118.7%, not 18.7%.

Third, this is not a question of how big to make the ship, but rather what ratio the weight should be distributed between the powercore and the weapon systems. For instance, if your ship has 100 space and ten weapons, you could make each weapon 8 weight and devote 20 space to the powercore, or you could make each weapon 1 space and devote 90 space to the powercore. If done correctly, the cost of the ship would be the same in either case, although one would supply much more fleet power.

There is substantial evidence, and some consensus, that weapons work best when they are given 8 weight, and get the rest of their supply from the powercore.

[plug]

Please do not misunderstand me. I too use 8 weight for my weapon. I came to this conclusion after plugging in a lot of numbers, one at a time.

But perhaps I'm talking out of context, I'm new here, there are a lot of things I've yet to learn. All I know is what I learn from plugging in all types of numbers, and through very costly trials and errors, with my ships got blown into pieces by much weaker opponents.

I got the numbers in the previous message on 7 weight instead of 8 weight because I take into consideration the cost of the ship as a whole, and like I said, perhaps I'm wrong in this.

Here's the way I look... to make it all in simpler term, let's say the original pship, sans weapon, costs 7,000 cr each. Let's say the weapon itself cost 1 cr each, and we only gonna fix 1 weapon in each ship.

Fixing an 8 weight weapon to that pship, the cost rises to 8156 cr. If we fix a 7 weight weapon to the same ship instead, the cost would be 7991 cr. A savings of 165 cr each ship.

And let's say our total budget for the pship is 10 Billion cr.

For the pship with 8 weight weapon, we can build a total of 10,000,000,000 / 8,156 = 1,226,091 pships.

For the pship with 7 weight weapon, the same budget we can build 10,000,000,000 / 7,991 = 1,251,407 pships.

And because you mentioned "Raw Attack", let's do some math, shall we?


A. (with 8 weight weapon) 1,226,091 pships X 37,443 = 45,908,525,313

B. (with 7 weight weapon) 1,251,407 pships X 37,283 = 46,656,207,181

Which fleet has a larger raw fleet power?

Peace ... ok?

[Chronos]

Ahh, I see what's happening. According to those numbers, fleet B would be better.

However, in most superships, the cost of each component is between 1 and 10 credits. Basically, a person makes the hull as large as he wants it, then he just divides space and energy among the powercore and other components until everything but the hull costs almost nothing.

The costs for a ship might end up looking something like this:

Hull:	1.254.209.222	credits
Powercore:	3	credits
Weapon:	7	credits
Computer:	2	credits
	...

That is generally accepted as the most cost effective, I think. Using those rules, all ships with the same hull-size should cost almost the same.

In this way, I created two ships, both with 42 space:

Ship 1	Weight	Energy	Attack
Powercore:	35	+8721	N/A
Weapon:	7	-8721	44347

──

Cost:

~7000

Credits

Ship 2	Weight	Energy	Attack
Powercore:	34	+8321	N/A
Weapon:	8	-8321	44387

──

Cost:

~7000

Credits

Both of these ships cost about the same (+/- 5 credits), but one has 40 attack more. Granted, 40 attack is a small amount, but you have to pick some number, and it adds up. Oh, and the difference becomes much more significant as you continue to decrease weight.


Sorry if I sound standoffish. I am just trying to help.

[plug]

In a way, you and I are both right.

It's that we tackle the problem from different angles.

And btw, I'm trying my hand in designing a 50 Billion cr supership.

What's the largest possible att / hp / acu / abs rating anyone ever achieve? My purpose in designing this 50 Billion cr supership is to learn the ins and outs of ship designing.