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IronEagle44 (#7613) is a leader of the alliance: Orion_Battle_Fleet
Their logo is a WWII badge with a swastika on it.

i don't think this is inappropriate, as the Nazi's were simply following Hitler, who was the insane man. I think it's ok.

Mmmmmm....It does have the whole 'jew persecution thing going though... :21:

not really, as long as they don't say kill the jews in their description, I don't see a problem with it.

I was starting this toppic. I wouldn`t mind a swastika without any statement, cause it was a religiouse symbol in the first place before hitler stylised it. I wouldn`t mind logos or names of armys, countries etc. There is for example a logo with an anchor, eagle and the world which stands for the US Marine Chor. Hey, it`s a game, and a name/logo should show off where you come from, where you are connected to, should spread fear*g*, sound funny and so on.
But this is an original swastika-eagle badge from WWII without any statement or explanation doesn`t only stands for an former army... I am german and this logo is a political statement, is still in use to spread political messages, as street code, as identification for people. In Without any statement can anyone of you say, this is in honour for dead soldiers, sth. like a roll of honour, is he working in a musee about WWII, showing a  restaurated tank with such symbols, soomeone who is playing a historical campaign with a friend? I will send him a message and ask him. But as it turns out to be political motivated, I want your support, or I`ll call myselve 9/11supporter, Stalin, UCK if this isn`t against the gamerules.
The other thing is, my french grandmother was murdered as a member of Resseau Alliance (Resistance) and my grandfather lost his leg wearing such a bag, I was beaten up by some guys who was tattooed with signs like these and useing these signs, because my Ex-girlfriend came from Sofia, Bulgary, liveing in germany since she was 6, stuying, working, liveing here  and speaks/writes better german than these guys.

Like I said, without a description saying anything about the persicution of jews, this is not a bad symbol, and we can't tell them they can't use it.

its life...people gets killed, other people gets mutated by losing some body parts, some people gets beat up....thats life...might as well get used to it like i did....

I knew I shouldn`t have bring up my personal experience. BTW: What`s it all about jews, you`re stuck on that, aren`t you? People get killed and suffer, get used to it? No comment!
"Without" a description it is a conclusion. If it says sth. like "we are the soldiers of Stalingrad, nothing to loose and ready to blast away everyone who stands in our way" I wouldn`t have any problems.
And what`s about my other points?
Well, nevermind, close this thread, I`m fine with that. I`m founding an alliance, the KKK, or maybe just a burning cross - logo (Does anybody know how the emblem of the KKK looks like, send one to me, I can use it). Or become the Gullack-overseer. What`s about 9/11 part2 and a chemical-logo? People die anyway and as long I`m not saying, procecute the jews.
I asked him nicely anyway to put a description besides his logo or if he could say to me why he took this logo, maybe he reacts. Shutting down his account would be overreacting (That`s not what I wanted)

I`m really sorry for starting this threat. Next time I take care of a problem by myselve before give it away. It turned out that sending him a message was much lesser work than starting a discussion. If he don`t reacts I`ll tell you that and you have to decide.
I`m back to the game.

I'll talk to Sir Emi about this and see what he says, though I really don't see how using an image is inappropriate, no matter what group it is from.

Complete and utter genocide. More Jews have been genocide-ed then any other religion or nationality, I believe. None the less, the crimes commited against them greatly out number the other anti-whatever crimes. And these things even happened in "modern" society. Such a dramatic step downward in our progression as humans. It was just barbaric.

Ok,  it isn`t a violation of the Tos. Nevermind. Maybe it`s just these cultural differences. This swastika is vorbidden by law. It`s not the first time I saw the swastika, for example sprayed on walls (which means, you are not german, get out of here. How many do we have to kill, how many refugee homes do we have to burn down till you leave?) That`s not only in germany a big theme.
 Sry that I brought up this toppic. Much more I`m sorry for beeing so dramatic, that sign was a red flag for me, but now I`m cooled down.
If you still wanna talk about WWII keep this threat open, if not, I`m out of here anyway.
Good night, and good luck.

And Chronos, you`re almost right, but I was talking about something else.

Sofiab, you are dead wrong if you are saying the swastika is forbidden in the united states. It is allowed to be displayed, PROVIDED that you have a good reason for it's display. Otherwise there would be MILLIONS of symbols banned for the reason that they upset someone.

Heh, ya. Crosses, Stars of David, Skulls, Pictures of Jesus, Whatever the Muslims Use, the Anarchy symbol, Yin Yangs, anything unpassifistic, etc.

I think that the Swastika was banned in Germany because it brings about really bad memories of a not too distant past. And the past can scare/annoy/anger people, which is most often not a good thing.

Ya but, forget not the past, lest ye repeat it!

the swastika symbol was the symbol of fertelism or something like that before hitler just it

The motif seems to have first been used in Neolithic Eurasia. It was also adopted in Native American cultures, seemingly independently. The swastika is used in religious and civil ceremonies in India. Most Indian temples, weddings, festivals and celebrations are decorated with swastikas. The symbol was introduced to Southeast Asia by Hindu kings and remains an integral part of Balinese Hinduism to this day, and it is a common sight in Indonesia. The symbol has an ancient history in Europe, appearing on artifacts from pre-Christian European cultures. By the early 20th century it was widely used worldwide and was regarded as a symbol of good luck and auspiciousness.

Since its adoption by the Nazi Party of Adolf Hitler, the swastika has been associated with fascism, racism (white supremacy), World War II, and the Holocaust in much of the Western world. Before this it had seen a resurgence in recognition from the archaeological work of Heinrich Schliemann, who discovered the symbol in the site of ancient Troy and associated it with the ancient migrations of Proto-Indo-Europeans ("Aryan" peoples). He connected it with similar shapes found on ancient pots in Germany, and theorised that the swastika was a "significant religious symbol of our remote ancestors," linking ancient German, Greek and Vedic culture.[1] [2]

Nazi use arose from this idea, developing from earlier völkisch movements, for which the swastika was a symbol of "Aryan" identity, a concept that came to be equated by theorists like Alfred Rosenberg with a Nordic master race originating in northern Europe. The swastika remains a core symbol of Neo-Nazi groups, and is also regularly used by activist groups to signify the supposed Nazi-like behaviour of organizations and individuals they oppose.

Know what you are talking about...  the issue is , in which context is it being used? 

eh get rid of it... personaly goes against my assumed religion (though im not much into religon now...)

as long as he does not violate the ToS with it, which he doesn't, we cannot make him get rid of it, he has every legal right to use it.

but still its a racist symbol now, i dont want to know the history of that but my grandpa had to live travling around morrocko and later the philapeanos and honolo to avoid the Naizs when he was a young boy... well at least they never caught him

it doesn't matter, the cross can be concedered a racist symbol, and sexist symbol, hell, it can even be considered a terroist symbol. As can you four armed even cross that is DDD's symbol, it can be concidered an offensive religous symbol. Everything can and most likely will insult someone. The person who is using that picture is not promoting anything the Nazi's did, and therefor is not breaking any rules.

well ddd is sort of a terroist lol thats what i do for fun on my free time

and yes i did think of it as something bad but i never knew what... never really commeneted on it just noiced but when wizard told me he got it out of an old game i was okay with it not being any racist thing

it appears to be a knights templar cross

yes, but it is used as many other things, but even as the Knights Templar cross it is insulting the church of christianity (which I personally am all for insulting). If we hold the guy/girl with the Swastika-logo responsible, then we must hold EVERYONE responsible. As long as he/she is not promoting what the Nazi's did, or promoting racism or anything else, he/she is fine.

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A cross, swasticka, whatever, is a case of symbolism, there are many symbols that stand for many ideals. Most of these symbols are re-hashed throughout the ages to stand for different ideals at the time. If Hitler had won the war, the swastika would have stood for a whole new ideal, based on the public perception. Its called history(those who win write it). There are many different symbols that have been used throughout the ages, to me the swastika is not so much an anti-semtic symbol(even though it was used as such for a short period of time) but as an ancient icon of days gone by. If people wanted to take these symbols as having a greater importance, why not look upon the cross as a symbol of torture. That is what it was used for, torture and execution. If we are so enlightened as to feel outrage at 1 symbol, why not look at the symbols we hold dear as those of different faiths would see them.
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Yes, my point exactly, thank you FOO.

but the comment you guys said it has is still not good...

Why can't people get over the past. It's been, it's gone, it's OVER. We should try not to live in the past, and look towards the future. That's what will really matter. There's nothing we can do about the past, the future we can shape for the better.

And why does everyone think the Nazis caused WW2. If you want to blame anyone, blame the American, French and British governments that forced massive restrictions and unpayable repayments on Germany at Versailles. That was where the second world war truly started. The german people wouldn't have voted the Nazis into power if there country had been in a reasonable state. But it wasn't. And if the Nazis had never come to power, the second world war could have probably been prevented, and the Holocaust would not have happened.

eh true on that... i was into to much Eurpean history last school year... you got a point there you can blame them for why germany started the war... but its not the war ppl are upset about its how the Natiz treated the jew and other minroitys in the concetation camps that pisses most ppl off

Everyone may think that the Nazis were really evil to do that to the Jews, and i'd agree, but it'd been happening for centuries before that. Anti-semitism was happening throughout europe. If the Nazis hadn't have committed the Holocaust, then someone else would have. It just the way the world was.

But it all changed. Whilst the Holocaust was one of the big tragicities of the 20th century, and probably the biggest and most ruthless extermination of civilians ever, it changed everyone's views about inequality. Everyone knew something had to change. So they tried to change it. Compare the world of the 19th century, with its massive amount of unequality and racism; with the world of today, at the start of the 21st century. I'm not saying the Holocaust was a good thing, it wasn't. It was pointless and an act of pure evil. But without it, racism would be alot worse then it is today, and the world would be a much worse place.

Change often happens in some of the worst ways possibly, and often many, many people will die to cause change. And although change isn't always for the best, things changed after WW2. For the better. We shouldn't forget what happened in the past. But shouldn't live there. The past has happened. Only present has been shaped, for better or for worse, it's your opinion to decide that. But we should look towards the future, and try to use the lessons we have learned from the past to change the future. For the better.

Good comes out of evil, but good can never come from evil.
Good can come from good, but evil is much more in abundance.
Perfect is devoid of evil and rich in good.

Some facts, interpret them as you will.

There will always be evil in the world, just as there will always be good. It's like the idea and Yin and Yang. They are both complete opposites, but they cannot exist without the other. There examples of it everywhere, Life and Death, Good and Evil, Love and Hate.
There's much evil in the world, but there's also good. Just because everyone seems to remember all the evil things that happen and have happened in the world, doesn't mean that there isn't good. Good and evil are everywhere, co-existing. Without good, how could we difine evil, and vice-versa.
And nothing is ever perfect, perfect is a term we use to explain something that's really good, or that really suits the occasion. Perfect is a word. Words can never fully describe what they are intended to. Only feelings can truly explain what you think of something.

 :4:

Ahem, good can exist without evil. They are already defined, the definitions won't change even if one disappears.

Fair enough, I suppose you're right.

By the way, people, the Holocaust is not the largest slaughter of people in the world. In fact, during Stalin's rule, more Russians died than Jews ever did in concentration camps.

yes we all know that a common history, but like what history said.. europe was better than russia, who cares about them  :wounded1:

As head mod, I am rulling this matter settled under these terms:

The accused has not violated a single rule of ToS, as he/she has not promoted what the Nazis' did, nor does he support what they did in any way shape or form. Therefore, he/she is in every right to use that picture and cannot be punished.

As for the good and evil thing, They do not exist at all, because we define them, and definitions can be changed. What does exist are actions and consequences. The action may do something horrrible, or helpful, but it is not good nor bad. Someone doing what is deemed bad may think he is doing good, because he is feeding his family, or following his religion. Therefore, good and bad cannot truely exist, nor can right or wrong. All they are are definitions that we made up. nothing more or less. And Yin and Yang is about the spirit for one, and it means the harmony within, you cannot have happiness without feeling sorrow, ect.

Does that mean if you're born you gotta kill someone? :P

no, it means if you are born you must die. Simple as that.

Wouldnt it be great if we had a council of players set up?  Then we could pass resolutions on what to allow and what not......oh wait:   well this is just the sort of thing for council

Wasn't the council supposed to be ready last round.

As far as that Egale Globe and Anchor is concerned I earned the right to Wear and display it.  and I will Up hold the Honor of it and not allow those without Honor to tarnish it.  IF you feel any that are flying that emblem are being dishonorable message me and I will make sure they do not have that avatar if they are being anything other than honorable.

no, it was suppose to be bready by the start of this round. I assume Emi is hard at work on it at the moment and we will be seeing it soon.