Forum - Space Odyssey MMORPG - a massive free online space game

Well some people have to take vacation w/o internet access, and if you have enemies odds are if oyu leave for a while and come back you wont have much left in the was of fleet... I wouldnt mind seein some kind of vacation mode where you are in nebula for however long you are gone (preset), but dont gain any interest or cash from workers, and dont gain any turns, or something along those lines at least... I think it would be a nice feature :)

It'd have to take you out of the rankings and DDay.

Rankings not needed Doomday yes, and vacation  mode should atleast be 2 days or sumthign so that you cant jump into vacation so that you dont get hit, while yuou make profit using the marker.

And ofcourse you may not have any counters on you anymore.

I would say have it so that it freezes the account, so that during the vacation time no changes are made to the account. No turns, no growth, nothing. Otherwise you would have people go into vacation to keep them safe while gaining power from growth. And yes Chronos take them out of the dday list.

Alliance truces would need someway of extending them if the alliance leader is on vacation. I know I'll be out of contact for about a month near the end of June, and being the leader of the alliance, my absence would prevent truces from being maintained.

You could make someone else leader fgor that time.

Ya, the accounts should be completely frozen, except for maybe alliance posts. You might be able to get internet access for a short period, and it'd be nice to give your alliance-mates an update or two.

And the truce problem could be fixed if Sir Emi implements the vice-leader feature.

yeah, for the VM you should be bale ot do absolutley nothing except messages and alliance stff, and minimum days 2-3 maybe... but yeah it owuld be nice cause i go away on weekends for 2-3 days alot and can set up powerfleets and such, but that dont stop me from gettin hit... and FTP, idk if counters should still count maybe, or else oyu could just vm to escape counters...

I think he meant that you shouldn't be able to go into vacation with counters on you.

but that wouldnt be very good cause then you couldnt hit ny1 for a few days in advance... maybe counters should just go normally, or perhaps freeze until vm is over (dont know if it could be done though...)

Well, that's pretty much the only fair way I see. :-\

Vacation mode=majorily bad idea. Why? Because it would affect the game too much. If you have to leave for a long time, find someone who plays the game that you trust, like an alliance member or something, or just a friend who will be home while your away, and have the manage your account. Give them detailed instructions on what to do and not to do.

i say make vacation mode so that it automatically logs you off when you click it and makes t so the next time you log on it turns it off and your open for anything so you CANT contact people in it or do market it makes you unable to be in vacation mode while your on

overall bad idea im with monkey on this one

Ok, well guys, let me just build about 1 trillion powerships once this gets implemented, go into vacation mode, make a second account (which is allowed) and wait until D-day activates and is about to end, and then log back into my first account and deactivate vacation mode. Guess what? I just took 1st place without even trying. See why it's a bad idea? If this were a game where you couldn't attack other players, it would work wonderfully, but this game relies on PvP (Player vs Player) attacks, so it won't work.

then it should have a 1 week min and can only be done once a month

no, because then those who go on vacation for a month get jipped. It just won't work, because no matter what you do it won't be fair.

if they go on vacation for a month they will be safe for a week and in this game if you go on vacation a month anyways your kinda jiped anyways because of the chain of attacks you can get unless you have one huge ship and a lot of credits in your hand so you can resuply marines every time

Didn't you have problems with the person doing things you didn't allow for them to do? (I seem to recall something to that effect.) Even if I'm wrong on that, you still have to find someone that you can trust.


This could be fixed by still allowing the normal everyone can attack everyone during the dday hours.

Another possible fix for the whole problem is to still allow attacks to occur, but refund a percent (doesn't have to be large 5-10%) of the cost of ships lost to the credits on hand. I like the idea of restricting access to messages and alliance board only during the vacation.


It may take alot of work Monkey D. Luffy, but eventually we may come up with something fair enough.

Ok finis, how about this then, i build my 1 trillion powerships, reserve them, then go on vacation. now you can't destroy them and I don't have to worry about losing my money because I'm in a permanent neb for the time I'm gone.

Trust me, a lot of mmorpgs have something like this, and it isn't fair to anyone. You can't balabce it.

As I said... eventually we may come up with something fair enough. I never said it would be a perfect system. Alot of details would need to be worked out to prevent abuse of the system. I think it is worth the effort to make an attempt to create a vacation system.

monkey: if you have the cash to build 1tril powerships and vaction mode doesnt last in DDay then wahts to stop you from just keeping the cash on hand and jumping up to high power in the last few seconds nyways? since cash on hand cant be touched then the money is safe nywaysm and just not in ships, and if oyu are in vacation mode oyu couldnt do nything with the ships nyways...  ithink it might work with some limitations... like maybe max vacation mode is a week and once used you cant use it again for 30 days, D-Day cancels  vacation mode, and maybe even your power is set to a very low level (like 1k or something) and all ur ships get put on reserve... that way it would cost ya a bit to go into vm but could still have benefits...

It wouldn't work at all, there is no way to balance it. If you limit the amount of time it is put on, those who are vacationing more then that get jipped, if you don't limit it, those who are still playing get jipped. The fact is, with a sytem like this, this type of game can't fairly play it. There would always be someone getting jipped, no matter how hard you try to balance it. And no Finis, it's not worth the effort of Sir Emi to waste months trying to balance something that cannot be properly balanced. It's a good idea, just not practical guys.

Something like vacation mode would require a lot of work to create, but I think that the bugs and glitches could be worked out of it if given time...

Vacation Mode:

-cannot be activated if you have attacked someone in past 24 hours (takes care of counters)

- no limit to how long, but a minimum of 3 days (max turns is worth 2 days already, so less then 3 is not needed anyway)

-DDay phase 2 cancels ALL vacation modes (anything further on 'if I then just had 1 tril pships' is really pointless, as stated before.  if you had that many, and could un-reserve them, vacation mode would have nothing, I repeat, NOTHING, to do with it, as they couldn't be touched anyway)

-Account is frozen, cannot log in unless it is cancelled due to DDay.  if you need to read the messages, that would mean you could get on, which means vacation mode was unnesecassary anyway


all in all, this will really put the person in vacation mode at a disadvantage.  the reason being, for 3 days solid, he will not grow whatsoever, meaning this whole time will be more time for others to catch up to him.

no vactaion mode BOOOO

that would mean all luna has to do is enter vaction mode and we never be able to attack him :(

I know this is an obvious exception to your first point ars68, but just so it is noted. Your counter attacks wouldn't count in that restriction.

As for the reading messages it could easily go either way, but you do make a point.

All-in-All ars68, I like it.

And Lammalord, if luna enters vacation mode, luna wouldn't gain any power according to ars68.

Ars68's plan is nearly flawless. I support it 100%.

I have had many times where I was able to get internet access once or twice during my long vacations. Now, once or twice in two weeks ain't worth no vacation, but it would be nice to be able to check up on your clan during those rare occassions.

Oh, and Midnight44, you have no clue to whether it's even credible, let alone nearly flawless.

It's no where near flawless, and I can tear it apart with one counter point.

Vacationer automatically forfieted round. Since they don't grow, even a week in this game is detrimental, but most people go on vacation for at least a week, sometimes two, or even a month! So for them not to grow at all ends their chances of being able to win.

Antoher point, though not needed, if you can't log in until either d-day happens or your vacation timer runs out, what happens if you end up coming home way earlier then expected? now you CAN play time wise, but due to your vacation setting, you CAN'T get on, which hurts your account.

Like i said, it is a great idea, but not practical as someone will always be getting jipped a whole lot with it in this type of game, and Sir Emi just doesn't have the time to fidle with attempting to balance this. when he has a lot of other updates that are in que to be added and are highly practical. It just won't work, I've checked every possible senerio, you cannot balance this equally for this game.

to save time, I put luffy's counter points as 1 and 2:

1: it is better then the alternative, being getting your account kicked 24/7 for that whole week.  and it is sorta the point to put him at a disadvantage for leaving.  he will be at a disadvantage for leaving no matter what.

2: that is also sort of the point.  he must then be ready to use vacation mode ONLY when he has to, and not for a second longer then necessary.  If he is planning on a vacation, 9/10 once it gets time to leave, he is leaving for the whole time.  however, there can be a set minimum wait time though, like 3-4 days, then after that you CAN leave, but again, this allows people to abuse it somewhat.  also, compared with current system of turns and such, you could probably safely end the vacation 1-2 days earlier then you plan on coming back.

and about DDay cancelling it, it is like this:

in phase 2 of DDay, everyone can attack anyone, regardelss of power levels or anything.  and phase 2 of DDay cannot be cancelled, altered, or halted unless sir emi himself changes it, which if it is going off, will most likely mean if he does anything to it, it will be shortening it.  and once the 24 hours is up, EVERYONE is reset to 250.500 power, which as most of you can see, is so low that simply getting a bunch of segments will skyrocket you out of range.   and so then he has no real need of vacation, as he is most likely not going to get attacked, and if he does, damage will be (almost literally) non-consequential.

so you see, it makes perfect sense, the whole way through.

except for if they go on vacation before D-Day, and you only countered one of my points. It just can't be properly balanced.

1: it is better then the alternative, being getting your account kicked 24/7 for that whole week.  and it is sorta the point to put him at a disadvantage for leaving.  he will be at a disadvantage for leaving no matter what.



2: that is also sort of the point.  he must then be ready to use vacation mode ONLY when he has to, and not for a second longer then necessary.  If he is planning on a vacation, 9/10 once it gets time to leave, he is leaving for the whole time.  however, there can be a set minimum wait time though, like 3-4 days, then after that you CAN leave, but again, this allows people to abuse it somewhat.  also, compared with current system of turns and such, you could probably safely end the vacation 1-2 days earlier then you plan on coming back.


I countered both of them...  basically, what you were saying was 'counter-points' is really actually the whole point TO a vacation mode.  you are saying that they will basically be forfeiting the round pretty much, well, in a way, they did that the second they planned a vacation, then.  nothing to do with vacation mode.  vacation mode will just be there to help minimize damage.  and your other one, while valid, is still why you should only use vacation mode when you must, being you have no other alternative. 

and you have to remember, this is because people have a real life to, this is just trying to minimize the damage due to that small fact.

The nice thing about vacation mode would be that people wouldn't completely forfeit a round and stop playing for a few months, just because they decided to go on vacation, and have their base and segments all taken away.

No vacation mode could -> people leaving forever.  Vacation mode could -> people leaving then coming back.

I'd rather get hit a ton then not grow at all. at least while you are getting hit, you are still growing, while you aren't in vacation mode, which hurts you MORE.

Either way, people would quit. Heck, they quit now because they dont get amazingly high easily.

Vacation mode just can't be properly balanced, if it could, I'd be all for it, but it can't without setting so many different variables that would allow for major abuse on both ends. What is fair is you know you are leaving, you set up lots of pships, have someone (alliance member, friend, ect.) watch over your account, and then leave. When you come back, you aren't hurt that bad, because they had to deal with all your powerships.

Monkey, if you get raided until you get nebbed (starting with 0 ships out), you lose over 20% of your workers and stash (due to having segments, which counts for some power anyway).  You can gain up to 10% of your workers and stash, if you have gold.

If someone takes out segments, it's a different story, but even if people only take out your stash 1/2 days, you end up losing.

For lower players, much of the power is in the segments.  There, again, not being present more than a few days can seriously knock you back.

And who says going on vacation makes you forfeit the round?  I have been growing very rapidly in power and am enjoying the game (enjoying it much more since I figured out how to mark my place in the rankings).  I did not start until well into the game, and did not fully grasp the concept of the game until much later.  And yet, I am beginning to feel important in this game (even if I'm not yet)...I'm already in the news when my power fleets are destroyed :D.

Lastly, just because you would rather not use vacation mode, doesn't mean others wouldn't.

It jsut can't be balanced to be fair. That's what you guys don't get. Sir emi won't add it if it isn't fair to everyone, and it isn't.

Something that might work would be able to select what ships you want your workers to make. Even if the number of ships is zero they will produce them. That way if everything gets wiped out you just start rebuilding those fleets. Doing this will maintain your interest and growth.

How isn't it fair though, Monkey?

It wouldn't really help the person doing it (except that they don't lose everything they have, which would occur if they didn't leave anyway), and it wouldn't really help the other players (except that their competition isn't growing, which is barely a leg-up).

All players could enable it.  It wouldn't help you grow, per se.  So what's not fair about it?  I'm not saying you're necessarily wrong, I just don't see what you're saying isn't fair.

The coding doesn't even seem (to me, I was only in computer science for a year or two, never really liked html) too difficult to change.  Just make them unattackable (either grayed out or in a nebula), set the growth of stash and workers to 0, and disable log-in for the entered number of days.  The hard part of that is setting the growth.  Of course, there'd probably be a check to make sure nobody has a counter on the person, and that they have nothing in the market (stuff on the ship is probably OK).  Still probably not terribly difficult to write up.  But then, html sucks, and I couldn't make those changes anymore...my last coding class was a full year ago now.

---

And Scruffy, that's an interesting suggestion.  It seems good, but thinking about it, wouldn't it use up all of your stash on the ship?  It would suck to be poking around in your base, click that, and find that you just spent all of your money on powerfleets (and instantly!).  Maybe if there could be a delay, or if it spends up to 20% of your stash resupplying/hour (pulling figures out of thin air, here).  Interesting thought, though...

Scruffy, your idea is as closed to balanced as it can get, and *might* work.

and it's harder then you think to do that. Here's the closest to actually fair to all that I can get it, using Scruffy's idea.

You select vacation mode, and go to a special screen that has a check list of all your fleets. You select which ones you want resupplied while your gone. Once you do that, you select the vacation button, and you're logged out. The next time you log in, it will exit vacation mode. There is no limit to how long you can be in vacation mode. Now, since you have ships being ressuplied, you can still be attacked, but, you only have to lose 10% of your total power to be put into a nebula (or this could be set to neb you if you have 0 ships), and you still have your workers and credits being produced and growing, o you don't fall far behind.

This is as fair as I can possibly get it, since you can still be attacked, raided, boarded and what not, but it's not so much where you will be destroyed completely. You get to continue your growing like normal, but others can still get stuff from you, so it's like you are still playing, only with slightly different rules.

I suppose that all's true, Monkey.

Looks like now we just wait to see if Emi wants to try to do it, and if it seems balanced to him.

I get the feeling that is actually even worse then the original vacation idea...

and ya, luffy, HOW is the way I said unfair to ANYONE?  you are thinking vacation mode would hurt more then letting it sit, only most likely because you never let it happen before.  news flash, all they have to do is take out your segments, and you will have NEGATIVE (not positive) growth for however long the vacation is for.  and then you will not only be losing so much in negative growth, but on top of that the extra raid attacks as well.  and in upper ranking accounts, more often then not, their ENTIRE segment power is not even 20% of their power compared to secret base.  which means FIRST DAY ALONE, without their powerfleets, they will IMMEDIATELY be at risk to lose ALL but maybe 5-10 segments, which will leave them, I think, not even 1 billion workers.  then the growth will be so low, they could then be further raided down since griwth won't cover the damage then.  then they come back a month later with an account with 5-10 segments, a couple million workers, and whatever they had in reserve and on hand.  does THAT sound fair to you?

and luffy, ya, OF COURSE we would all like to just let someone we trust take care of our account for us, but more often then not, it is the EXCEPTION, NOT the norm that someone can truly do that without worrying if his account is going to be totally screwed up.  you said YOURSELF, last time you let someone on your account, he ended up making your account badmouth about everyone in the game, found and exploited a bug (which is breaking ToS itself, sometimes grounds for account ban) and what else?  I think you should be about the LAST person openly suggesting that.  especially when there is ALREADY a case of what? 3-4 hacking attempts to ruin other peoples accounts?

what we WERE trying to suggest, was a vacation mode for the average person who cannot trust anyone else to sit his account for him, that will not end up leaving him COMPLETELY dead in the water.

oh, and why do I say the selected fleets idea is bad?  think of it, if we had that, all I would have to do is set it up everyday, and no matter how hard anyone tried, they could NEVER get more then 1-2 actual attacks on me.  and any pships left when you come back, you can just sell for half off, or try to lose them in missions for 80% back.

--edit: couldn't really remember why exactly the specific build option was bad, but now I remember.  would imagine Ricu right now using that vacation mode with powerships?  with the amount of money he would get and such, he would just continue to rise indefinetely WAY out of reach of ANYONE, who could attack him.  and the others around him could make sure no one else started trying to climb up to him either.  it would basically mean whoever got first place the quickest would be the winner, almost no questions asked.

there could be restrictions to it, to prevent ships under a certain size from showing up.

But it wasn't fair because one way, the vacationer had all the advantages, the other way the players had it. You guys never had any sort of balance.

Branching off of Scruffy's and Monkey D. Luffy's suggestions to prevent charmuska's mentioned problem of it spending to much of your stash, you can set a limit to fleet size that they won't be resupplied after that number has been reached. And combined with Monkey D. Luffy's size minimum for the automatic resupply during vacation this should help in preventing the problem mentioned by ars68 as well.

You make a good point Monkey D. Luffy, we were thinking of just one side or the other without thinking of both.

ok, call em dense if you want to, but


does not sound like an answer as to HOW it is unbalanced.  the way I have been saying would not give the vacationer, as he would not grow in power, nor lose any power.  the other players would not have any advantage except that they would then have a chance to severely cripple, and possibly next to destroy, the other person's account which was worked on for months.

personally, I would rather have this so if I went on vacation I didn't have to worry about coming back to find out 4-5 months of work on this game ended up being for absolutely nothing, just because someone thought it might be unfair for the other person that he loses ONE possible target for a couple weeks.  Seither, I don't where you've been, but as far as I can see, the suggestion I put forward IS balanced, as possibly as it possibly can.  and evidently even more balanced then what anyone else thought it could be either.

so I say again, tell me HOW my suggestion is unfair to ANYONE.  you keep on saying that, that it 'can't be balanced' that 'it favors one or the other' so many times like as though YOU HAVEN'T EVEN READ my suggestion, dismissing it before you even gave it a look.

ok luffy, if u think vacation mode is unfair to the vacationer, it should still be an option... after all yo udont have to use vm, but iof you are in the top 50, go away for a week and you are dead... also it doesnt ruin ur chances of winnign a round, look at some of the numbers in the top 10 even... ive see bigbroni, # i nthe 11000s which means he missed about 2-3 months of this round, and is already up high... also quite a few other people in top 50 with high numbers... hell i have an alt in the billions of power wit ha decent store of cash that started liek 2 1/2 month late w/o donating nything, so being frozen for a week wouldnt hurt som1 as much as being a target would... and it would be a matter of choice, if oyu think vacation mode is abd for you, dont use it, but if you know itll help, then go ahead, not liek yo uwould be forced to use it...

Ars, I made tons of counters to your suggestion, but here, let me tear it appart for you again. The person who leaves gets jipped because they fall far behind. Even a week without growth can finish the round for you, as you'll never catch up. The attackers get jipped because they cannot use that person to grow on. It's not fair to either player. My idea is close, though still slanted in favor of the vacationer, which it should be, but the attacker should still be given a fair chance to hit the person, wither they're able to play or not.

And shadows, I'm saying as for the whole of SO it would be a bad idea. I always look at suggestion for the effects on the whole game, not just me. So please, don't try to act like you know how I'm viewing this. I'd like to see this game improve, not diminish, and to do so, it has to be as fair as possible to all players. Would you want to play if someone could just freeze their account with 10 trillion, like ricu, and wait until the end of the round then come out of nowhere and win because of it, all because you couldn't hit them while they were frozen? I'd quit if that happened, and with ars's/most everyone elses suggestions, something like that would be easy to do.

Monkey, if ricu has 10 tril, he doesnt need to go into vacation ot be safe, he can keep all money on hand if he wanted then just use the 10 tril at the end of the round ot jump up nyways...

ah, but your vacation mode would let him keep his ships is my point. Then when he comes back it's an easy win. That is what I'm pointing out.

How is killing his ships now easier than killing them later?  You seem to contradict yourself a little bit.
Even if he can keep the ships better this way, why is it so much better than him keeping the money to buy those ships later?  Is there some distinct advantage to being #1, where every ship is twice as good for the same cost?  If not, it shouldn't matter where he freezes.
If someone wanted to go on vacation mode with power fleets out, he gets more attention, nebbed upon return, and nothing more.  What advantage does this bring?

People aren't growing by leaps and bounds when they leave either.  How is not gaining interest so much more devastating than gaining some, then having to spend it replenishing fleets?

At times, yes, having one more target can help (at one point, 2/3 people I could attack who had ships were my accounts, and the third had too many marines to steal his ship).  But how's it different if someone's nebbed vs. in vacation mode (as far as the attacker's concerned)?

because they were saying the vacationer be in a permanant neb, so if they leave for a month, thee's a month of a neb. Second off, let's say commander A has 100B in his base and 5% growth, the max for non-gold. Every day he earns 5B. He's gone for a month. 5*7*4=140, he loses enough to double his secret base. And the advantage is that he froze his account with good ships, and did it for 3 months we'll say. During that time, another commander makes a ship that can take the vacationing commander's ships out. D-Da comes around, and the commander who was froze is now able to play again. He quickly shoots up to the top because of his reserved ships, and the guy who could of destroyed them earlier lost his ships to a mission. Now no one can beat the frozen commander, so he wins. Then if the guy is frozen and not able to be touched and D-day rolls around, another commander could have raided him and gained credits, but can't because he is untouchable.

Have not readed everything but this is how I see vacation mode:
1. You may not go in vacation mode if ppl have still counters on you.
2. Vacation mode will take atleast 2 days.
3. If a leader goes on vacation he can choose who ever is in command till his return.
4. No growth or what ever is possible at this acount. It totaly freezes. If you go in vacation mode with 10 trill you'll coem out with 10 trill. (and no turns gained)
5. When Dooms-Day starts everyone goes automaticly out of vacation mode.
6. Eveyrone who is in vacation mode will have a V symbol at the place of the nebula symbol.

There are no disadvantages about this. None of the holiday seekers will have an disadvantage, they just have to not attack in 24 hours aint that hard.

As shadows said whats the differents between putting 10 trill credits on hand and reservign all fleets and going on vacation mode except that now you dont lose youre workers/segments (the idear of vacation mode).

It will always take 5 min for you to go into vacation mode so if someone is already attacking you he wont just boom egt stopped becus you quikly push the vacation button. And as minimum time is 2 days you cant do a f**k for those 2 days. You wont have interest turns etc so you wont improve youre time.

Now dont say if you do go on vacation mode you lsoe so much interest and stuff you wont be able to get up again, well its youre own choice to use this option you dont have to use it. And you can even ask another player to play for you.

Ok, how are you not jipping the other players with this? They cannot benifit from that person who is in vacation mode. They are getting jipped. That's why I said give the vacationers their interest, but make it so they have to set a resupply fleet with a max amount of ships that you determine how many it is, but they go neb at 10%, which is a pretty fair balance. This way, they get to leave and grow still, but people can attack them and use that to grow in power. But they can't do this while they have counters on them.

But then all they'd need to do is set them to produce powerships and they get a perma-neb and interest.

ok...  breaking this again down to points, I will show you right here how NONE, not a single one, is actually legit.

1: The person who leaves gets jipped because they fall far behind. Even a week without growth can finish the round for you, as you'll never catch up.

as opposed to what?  coming back from the vacation that will happen sooner or later anyway, finding that instead of falling behind week or 2 in interest, is instead back pretty much where they started MONTHS ago?  :21: nice point there seither, really makes sense  :21: sorry, but no go here.

2: The attackers get jipped because they cannot use that person to grow on.

while you may have a point to an extent of someone losing a potential victim to attack, it ends right there.  what are they going to take?  if it is just workers and credits in secret base, fine.  if that was just it, I would have no problem with it.  however, if they take segments, that means eventually in so many attacks they will run out of segments to take ANYWAY, and because the person who plays the account can't get back on and correct the situation, the only thing that can be taken will quickly diminish, totally jipping the person who left, AND jipping the attacker in the long run, as now he has lost that 'potential' victim 'potentially' for the rest of the round, instead of for just a couple weeks.  and even then, most of the time, it is MUCH MUCH more profitable to go ahead and launch a volley of attacks ona bunch of MISSIONS, as they grow in profit with you, not like someone who consistently yields less and less rewards every time you hit them. sorry seither, but I think that's a no go here to, in more then one way.

3: Would you want to play if someone could just freeze their account with 10 trillion, like ricu, and wait until the end of the round then come out of nowhere and win because of it, all because you couldn't hit them while they were frozen?

(and quite possibly the EASIEST out of the 3) Seither, let me give you a hypothetical situation, if EVERYONE around you, I mean everyone, from the lowest point that could attack you, all the way to number 1, all of a sudden froze their accounts attempting to do this, and remained so for months, do you:
a: sit there and do nothing waiting for them to come out
or
b: grow stronger then them thanks to the fact that NO ONE can even attack you, let alone hurt you.

of course the answer is B, who wouldn't, unless they SERIOUSLY wasn't actually interested in playing.  by the time they come back with those 10 trillion, the other people around them may end up be using QUADrillions.  hence, in their attempt for a shortcut to #1, they instead doomed themselves to anything but #1, as anything they build then would be matched and overwhelmed, especially when would only have 24 hours to make their comeback, with everyone else being able to freely attack them.  so once again (and for the 3rd and final time) still a no go with those counterpoints.

so I say again, WHAT reason could you still possibly have to be so adamant about being against a vacation mode?  and besides, even if they COULD do 3, all sir e would need to do is to disable re-supplying of ships for the last 1-2 minutes of play, where then anyone trying to build that last minute powership fleet would just get shot down.  I simply do not see how any of your points are in all reality of the game, able to happen.

in short: Seither, for the love of all that is good, STOP comparing someone in vacation mode to someone who normally plays.  the disadvantages of someone trying to abuse the vacation mode CAN be extreme, but IF they are truly simply wishing to be gone for a long time, they will be gone anyway, so instead compare someone in vacation mode to someone inactive for that time, because if they are going to just be inactive for a while, they will more then likely be gone for a couple weeks max, then be back plenty of time to re-strengthen themselves. 

and even if the penalties WERE extreme, to the vacationeer, SO WHAT? then that would simply give people 1 less reason to abuse it, and leave it for only those who truly are using it for what it was intended to be.

oh, and FTP, I basically said what you just did.

which leads me to a second point, about your 'proposed' vacation mode idea, which can be shot down with this REAL situation.

If the #1 person did it, with even a 2 day wait, that is right there with the max turns you are able to have.  so he goes into your vacation mode, comes back every 2 days to use all his credits and everything, and it will almost be like he played like normal.  even with longer times, say 5 days, he comes back every 5 days, throws ALL his credits on hand, uses all his mission turns, and goes back in.

this could never happen with my version of it, because he leaves with 10 turns, he will come back, with 10 turns. 

and even without it, the interest would still allow you to do it, just not as much, and without interest, you may as well go with my idea, as it will pretty much be the same.

oh, if he is allowed to attack every 24 hours, every 24 hours for a couple weeks, the person will lose up to 2/3 of 10% of all his segments.  you do the math.

I'm not against it ars, I'm saying unless we meak it really fair, it shouldn't be added, because while it may improve parts here and there, people are smart, and someone will find a way to abuse it big time, so they can be unstoppable.

And with my idea, we can restrict the type of attacks to attacking, scouting, and raiding only, and cut the amount of segment rewarded for a victory if needed. Like I said, the idea I put up is slightly slanted towards the vacationer, but it should be, but at least the other players may still attack them. But to be fair, any attack would leave a counter that once the person returned from vacation, they would have twenty four hours to use it.

And ars, I said give them interest, not turns. Their turns should remain frozen, but they should be allowed to continue growing.

This is the whole reason I say we might as well not implement this. It cannot be done fairly where someone can't abuse it or isn't getting cheated out of being able to grow. We could cut interest greatly or something, maybe make it so workers still produce credits, just so when they come back, they at least did some gaining. Also, we can make it so once you've activated vacation once, you must wait a set amount of time before you can do it again. and we can make a minimum of a week, since most people who go on vacation go for at least a week.

Perma-neb would be much simpler, and more abuse free.

Anyways, don't forget that if somebody finds a remote overlooked way to abuse vacation mode, Sir Emi can just :banned: and fix the used method of cheatery. Of course, we're still going to have to iron out every possible abuse we can think of before hand.

Exactly. Maybe once the game evolves a bit more, it'll be practical, but i say until then, no, it shouldn't be added.

ok if you get less out of hitting a person in vacation mode and they still get a counter, and can grow almost unchecked while not there, y would you do it? that just makes it unpractical to hit som1 in vm, so as a result the person in vm just gets interest, workers, maxes out turns, and gets 1 hti neb evry time if som1 is stupid enoguh to hit them, this would make it an advantage to go into vm for 2 days, come out, use turns, and go bak in totally safe...
I also dont see how oyu can abuse the vacation mode me and ars proposed, as yo uare totally frozen, and dont give me this gives the vacationer a disadvantage, because if the person thinks it does they dont have to use it... also i have no idea how it could be abused as you are frozen and cant have ny counters on you, so you just stay their pretty much...if i was going away for 2 days i wouldnt bother using it as id be fine, but for a week that would look very tempting as oy uwould lose a lot more hten growth from gettin hit, especailly at low powers... all in all i dont see what is wrong with vacation mode...

finally, someone who agrees with me, I thought I was just ttalking to myself for a while, with no one listening.

ok, seither, for the last time, STOP COMPARING SOMEONE IN VM TO SOMEONE PLAYING REGULARLY!

actually, I don't know WHAT your thinking...


seither... don't you mean it is supposed to be slightly slanted AGAINST the vacationer???  if you are making it even a SMIDGEON slanted towards the vacationer, OF COURSE it will be unbalanced.

let me put it this way:

I go into VM for even a week, all this time being gone that week, everyone else will gain, leaving me behind, or closing any gaps between me and #2, if not surpassing me.  which will automatically mean, almost no matter what, it will NOT be worth it to go into VM, but instead stay out of VM, and simply play normally.  If I am simply trying to shortcut to victory to DDay, I will have less a chance of winning now because they will be closer to me then they were before, and still have to survive any attacks for the 24 hours before the end of the round.

NOW, let's say I am ACTUALLY LEAVING for that 1-2 weeks.  if I DON'T go into VM, then that will mean I will get hit unhindered that whole time, without the chance to re-build.  all of a sudden, going into VM looks pretty good, to CUT THE LOSSES.  it has never been a matter of preventing them from losing strength, it has simply been a matter as to cutting unneeded losses.

put it simply: making it slightly against the person going into VM, it will make it unwise to fake the VM.  but it will still be MUCH better then just sitting there getting hit 24/7.  you are saying making slanted in advantage TO the person in VM, which would just encourage people unneedingly to find ways to abuse it further.

You people seem too keep ignroing to vats I've said with my ideas.
right at the bold poarts I had already answered the problems. It isn't fair to anyone to completely freeze a persons account, because with the way the game changes, something could happen that gives them a major advantage because they froze their account.

Wnd ars, the people will abuse it either way. we might as well shut the game down because of people being able to abuse too much.

well, at this point I think I'll take any reason as final just to stop my arguing   :sweat :yawn:

even how ridiculous the reason really is


1: game changes in middle of VM may give them unforeseen advantages

I'm not sating it could happen, though it quite possibly might. I've given solid reasons as to why vacation mode being a frozen account thing is bad, and you've replied with half loaded answers and the bending of my words. Overall, i'm completely against the idea, but if it was to be implemented, it should not involve account freezing at all, end of story. I rest my case, Sir Emi may be the judge of the better idea. Court is ajourned for recess.

Half loaded answers? Twisting of words?

I've seen plenty of valid answers you've yet to solidly rebuke.

That's because they were ALREADY COUNTERED IN MY PREVIOUS POST(S)!

It's up to emi to decide if this should be implemented, and if so, which idea is more fair. We presented our cases, now it's time for the judge to review it and give a verdict. Just let it reset until then.

ya, as I said, I'm getting tired of this argument, just let it rest, E will (hopefully) take a look and decide which is better.  I just hope some kind of this IS implemented, because playing for a good 4 months solid, then losing everything you have because you can't find someone to play for you for 2 weeks while on vacation doesn't sound very good...

Neither the 10 Trillion Powership argument has not been adiquately unrebuked. Nor has the Vacationer Get's Jipped argument been completely validated, I am lead to believe.

well, I can help the last one of that... 

In order for vacation mode to be balanced, it must be slanted against the vacationer, but less than not going into vacation mode. Anywhere in that range is perfectly all right. It just depends on how much you want to, erm, disadvantage the vacationer. Which you should do, to some extent.

well now that interest is just about killed and growth close to non existant i htink vacation mode would be a good feature to have :)

ya, let me put it in a way that I hope everyone (even Seither) can agree to.  when dealing with a vacation mode, no matter what, it should look like this:

least wanted         what VM should be                   most wanted
     l                               l                                          l
    \/                             \/                                         \/
 
leaving an                some way of                         someone to play
account                  freezing the                          your account for
to sit there              account so                           you, or just play
and get                   the account is                      Space Odyssey
pummeled                neither hindered                    while on vacation
                             nor helped


as you can see by my wonderful doodling (yes, applause is appreciated :)) ) VM mode should set in a happy middle area between the 2 extremes.  of course, everyone wants someone to just play their account for them.  man, I sometimes want someone to play my account for me even though I am going on no vacation.  but no one wants their account to remain completely untended to, open 24/7 for constant attacking.  sure, damage protection will help tons, but still not really enough to save your account from a sever punishment from other players.

Ofcourse you should implent with it when you click on activate Vacation mode it will active an hour after you clicked, you cannot hide while there are still counters on you. And vacation mode will atleast be for 2 days you can de-activate it earlier.

i dont see it workingcause then all people have to do is get high ranked and come Dday go on vacation and stay untouched while others take damages thats the only possibleprob i could see

already been covered lol, weve already said vacation mode automatically shuts off for phase 2 of DDay and oyu cant be in the DD armada while in VM

After delving into the mind of the vacationer and living amongst them for many a days. I can safely say that pretty much any kind of vacation mode would be greatly appreciated by me-... Erm, I mean them.

Seriously, even being frozen would've helped me out a lot!

Anyways, I'm just glad Sir Emi is implementing it (http://forum.spaceo.net/index.php?topic=1053.msg13911#msg13911).